Quality control

[Maximohoundoom]

I'd like to make a small complaint about the quality control of the files that were accepted in this website. I'd blame the sequencers, but I think the cause of it is also in the people who decided the MIDIs were ok.

Well, I'll explain the problem a bit better. Yesterday I happened to have found a song that sounded completely terrible here. And it wasn't in new files, it was in Game Boy Advance: F-Zero GP Legend. This is the link to it: http://www.vgmusic.com/music/console/ni ... ITY_18.mid
It looks like it starts ok, but after the beginning, EVERY single note is out of tune (At least using Windows Vista MIDI instruments). I know they call it a "remix" but I thought remixes still had to sound good somehow. My question is: Who allowed this file to appear in the music section?

Well, I've seen a number of other bad MIDIs of songs that I liked and no real good versions. So I decided that the people who came to this site needed an alternative, that's when I started making good MIDIs of them. I'll list just a few of the songs that I really didn't like and the alternate versions I created of them(The songs that aren't on this site are ones I didn't consider good enough to put here, but they are still better than the bad ones):

Sonic R - Resort island
Bad | Good
Sonic Adventure 2 - Mission street:
Bad | Half decent
Pokémon Ruby/Sapphire - Wild Pokémon:
Not right | Half decent
Pokémon Gold/Silver - Trainer Battle:
Not very good | Correct(not really good or really bad)(An early arrangement of mine) | Very bad intro, decent song(A recent remix of this song)

I have not taken into account who made the bad files, I make no personal offence to them. Whoever made them is unimportant, what matters is that they were accepted in VGmusic when they shouldn't have been. I know some of you are not going to like reading this and will consider me a show-off. I am just giving my opinion, if anyone decides this post must be closed I will respectfully accept it.

[Blitz Lunar]

You're right about this one - http://www.vgmusic.com/music/console/ni ... ITY_18.txt - it's awful. I deleted it. I've deleted other files by that guy before too, so I don't know how that one got past me - some do sometimes...

And that's just the thing... the staff here aren't omnipotent by any means. We're actually (in my opinion) understaffed and have a lot of midis to get through. I'm the only active updater, for a start. And while we strive to familiarise ourselves with many soundtracks (or at least I do, I'm always seeking new OSTs irrespective of having played the games... can't speak for others), our knowledge isn't entirely encyclopaedic, and in many cases when updating we just go with our intuition on what sounds like its been well sequenced.

Sometimes stuff does slip through the net like the aforementioned file, so you are encouraged to point things like this out (read the sticky on this board), and we (probably I) will broach it on a case-by-case basis. We don't have pride and won't be offended by it. In a perfect world I'd make an effort to listen to the original version for every midi cover I listen to, but in practice that isn't feasible time-wise, and will just mean the site never gets updated. It already doesn't get updated often enough.

The other "bad" midis you listed aren't bad enough to delete. The Sonic R one, while inaccurate compared to the second one, isn't appalling - and actually the other Sonic R one is completely missing the melody line on some devices - probably due to use of Roland variation banks without using a proper MIDI reset... that's my guess without investigating. Similar sort of story for the Pokemon ones... they're kinda poor, but they were added some time ago, and they're not so awful that they should be removed.

Naturally, complaining about the quality of files in the new-files is pointless unless you complain directly to the sequencer, because that really isn't anything to do with us until it gets added.

I have not taken into account who made the bad files, I make no personal offence to them. Whoever made them is unimportant, what matters is that they were accepted in VGmusic when they shouldn't have been.

It's entirely important who made them. The files don't become property of vgmusic once they're accepted; we just host them. They take responsibility for their goods (or craps, whichever the case may be). Bad files reflect on the archive as a whole, so the really crap stuff is deleted somewhere along the line (generally speaking), particularly amongst new submissions - that is, anything I deal with.

[Maximohoundoom]

Well, I'm sorry for the trouble. I think I spoke a bit harder than i should have, but after hearing the Mute City song, I began to remember the few other songs I didn't think like very much and got carried away. You're right about them. While their notes, times and beats are not the same as the original song, they still sound similar enough, I guess. I just like MIDIS to sound as close to the original as possible, so I'd probably be a bad MIDI critic.

When I said that I wasn't taking the sequencer into account I actually meant to say that I was talking about those particular songs and not just any music the sequencers may have made. I can't judge a sequencer by one single MIDI alone and I won't tell him he's a terrible person for making just that one wrong(although MIDIs from the same sequencer usually have the same quality). It is possible for a sequencer to make a really bad song and then a really good one.

Well, that's all. I guess next time I'll think longer before writing. Thanks for answering.

[Arrow]

I can't judge a sequencer by one single MIDI alone and I won't tell him he's a terrible person for making just that one wrong(although MIDIs from the same sequencer usually have the same quality). It is possible for a sequencer to make a really bad song and then a really good one.

As the guy who made that "bad" Sonic R MIDI, I just want to point out that I made it back in June of 1999 (I had only started making midis in 96), and my skill set is on an entirely different level nowadays; hell, even tracks I made in late 2000 were better by an order of magnitude. I personally don't care for that old thing, but it's the staff's decision as to whether they want to get rid of it or not.

This post really has nothing to do with the issue about less than perfect MIDIs staying in the archives; I just sort of felt the need to counter your line that MIDIs from the same sequencer have the same quality. Though you already said you can't judge a sequencer by one track, so it's probably not a big deal.

[Maximohoundoom]

What I had said in the first message was not totally right. I really had gotten carried away and started ranting. I tried to correct myself in the second message, I now realise that the only one worth removing was the out-of-tune Mute City song. I understand now it would probably be a rather big shame and mistake to remove the other ones which, heard in a general manner, sound pretty much like their original versions. When I made my first post I had been focusing on the fact that the individual notes were not exactly the same as in the real songs, which doesn't seem to be very important.

Arrow, I have nothing against you. In fact, since your MIDI is so old I have a lot of respect for you. If you really made that MIDI in 1999, then you've been sequencing for at least 9 years. That makes you way more experienced than myself, with just one year of practise. I have found your music in a number of Sonic pages, which makes your work famous. So I actually feel honored to be able to talk to you in this forum, despite the fact that I was not interested in that particular song.

About what I said: I can't judge a sequncer by one track. I meant to say that, if I criticize any work I don't base my criticism on the fact that the author may have made other MIDIs better or worse (or that I like the author more or less). Well, if noone has anything else to say I think the topic should be closed, there was little reason for it to exist in the first place.

[Daniel Lawrence]

Just to pick up on what Lunar said, the staff are not all-seeing and all-knowing. Lunar works harder than most (past and present) on updating, and I would rather correct a few mistakes from the updating process than have the files still sitting in the new-files section.

We appreciate having files brought to our attention, so please do feel free to point out anything you don't think belongs in the archive, or if you see any mistakes that need to be corrected.

[Nova]

I'm sorry if this is off topic, but you aren't looking for new staff members are you?

Well if you are, I might be able to help. I'm assuming you're not, but it doesn't hurt to check.

[Teck]

I would also like to ask about applying for Updating, but you see...I am simply too lazy...and until I learn to rectify that, I don't think Updating is up my alley. =X

[X]

I would also like to ask about applying for Updating, but you see...I am simply too lazy...and until I learn to rectify that, I don't think Updating is up my alley. =X

Rectifying is easy. All you have to do is have the proper equipment, which you can probably find at your local RadioShack.

Seriously though, I actually wouldn't mind helping with updates either. I know that I usually get nothing accomplished with whatever free time I ever have, so it sounds like something worthwhile to me. I wouldn't quite know what you expect in terms of quality control on the matter, but I've got the general idea. Unfortunately, I expect that if you really desired more update staff that you would probably already have made that known on the boards, so sorry if this post seems out-of-turn.

[The Ultimate Koopa]

What about me as an updater?

I wonder ... hmm...

I'm expecting either... a holy freaking crap, no f*ing way... or a still-negative-but-nt-as-harsh response ... but that doesn't mean you can't say yes, if you really think I could

[Secret Agent Man]

What about me as an updater?

I wonder ... hmm...

derp derp derp... derp derp derp derp, derp derp derp... derp derp derp-derp-derp-derp-derp-derp derp ... derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp, derp derp derp derp derp derp

[solis]

CheeriNos was better..

[The Ultimate Koopa]

You made me sad.

I.... KEEL-a YOOOOO!

Meh, I was kind of joking, but honestly, what would be the reason for the 'no'?
Is it that you'd think I'd be far to extreme, and like reject songs which have just a slight tempo issue (like having 0.5 bpm slower than the real thing), or that one note was wrong?

or is it that you'd think I'd be too darn lazy and probably not do the job often enough (like once every 3 months)? Be honest, though.

[Secret Agent Man]

Meh, I was kind of joking, but honestly, what would be the reason for the 'no'?

Well....

1) You're incredibly irritating to interact with.
2) You've been banned here before, and have come close to being banned again. In fact, the reason you're not banned right now is through a set of questionable circumstances at best (creating a second account, pestering admins to be given a second chance, etc.)
3) There are many, many better-qualified candidates for the job.
4) You're over-reactions to the simplest of things (e.g. your recent MIDI rejection) doesn't really help your case (ties in to #1).

[dw_junon]

You have not explicitly offered any effective persuasive reasoning why we should consider you for such a position.
You have previously tried to moderate the forums in direct defiance of the rules.
You are liable to be pedantic over trivial irrelevancies as well as more significant details, which would make for slow updating.
You are known to ask lots of questions, which is not necessarily productive either.
You are also known to lash out in communication generally when it is not to your liking.
You respond especially poorly to criticism (with apparently nominal difference in response between constructive and non-constructive types).
In such a position your particularly enthusiastic reactions might impact on the members of and potentially the reputation of the site in negative ways.
You don't seem to realise the potential consequences of playing with unfamiliar URLs that do things you don't understand.
You have annoying emoticon habits.
You seem to be ultimately mostly unaware of your unsuitability as a candidate.
You also to be mostly unaware that how you present your concern regarding how you are perceived is negatively affecting how your are perceived.
It is unlikely that a majority of the staff would support your appointment. I could not support such a proposal myself.
You are apparently threatening to kill (one of?) us.